Things You Can Do in the Free Cam Chat
It is starting to be a dying art and it is sad. This new guy leaving his girlfriend and steeping into swoon mine, knowing our loving history, to then go meet her family only 2 months later also shows he is just like her.
He only cares about himself. He gets what he wants, at all costs. And she will learn this the hard way. She ruined any love I have for her and she may never be loved as much as I loved her. And that is too bad for her. We are all entitled to be passionate about our interests.
She deserves to feel wanted, listened to, interesting. Forget marriage — make it an eternal date. No one wants to feel like they are taken for granted.
What a fabulous article. It was a very clear flag for men to pay attention to the ONE thing that seems to come up time and time again. As for finding passion… do the opposite of what you did to lose it. Likely you both got comfortable. She is doing her comfort zone thing and you yours and poof.. But challenge, adversity, adventure are the things that can pull together even the most bored and restless souls.
Get in the car and agree to find a city miles away without a map. Land in a new country with a different language and do it without hotel reservations. We do this at least every two years rather than buying new TVs and toys and dammit.. We have stories … memories that we constantly work to build together. Yup I do less tinkering than the average girl with my hobbies and he his… way less golf and TV Sports..
When we tell our stories to friends we laugh and hold hands.. I agree with Andrea. Because you never know what pushes the women into that mode. For example I know of a friend who built a safety technology, single handedly, for a high accident rate zone for a particular kind of industry. It became a moral obligation for him to deliver it to as many companies as possible. He know she missed her dad and he decided no child should ever undergo the pain of losing its dad to some accident at the factory.
Obviously, his GF missed the whole point of his maneuver to deliver it to as many factories as possible. She failed to see every good thing the guy did. She failed to see that he wont be getting anymore salary than what his contract said. She pushed him to decisions, and then made him go with them. Asked him to stand with her on those decisions, in the process guy lost all his personal powers and freedom to practice. The guy is still alone at the factories and traveling across cities delivering things to those factories.
His GF is still kind of under the same mode. I agree with this article but I think that there is a paradox involved with domestic life. You eat a safe, responsible, adult partner who comes home every night but then at the same time you want Don Juan Demarco to sweep you off your feet. Men believe they show their love through being responsible men that take care of year families.
If you let someone else sweep you off your feet, when your in a committed relationship, you are a total jerk face. I am independant and can provide for myself. The article urges men to make at least 5 minutes a day to really see their wife. The author understands life gets us in a rut but we need to work with what we got to get through it. Yes, i agree with you that communication is key. He asks me this from time to time- In a different kind of way but I get it.
Thats actually an interesting article. I fear I may be guilty of this. We are always together, I am a rather sensative man althoug she would disagree but I do sometimes take for granted her presence. I truly do love my wife but we have this disconnect when it comes to our emotions entangled on the same level. She gets hurt, which sometimes I can be an ass but also sometimes I have no clue. She is really hurt and we have been rounds and rounds and the hurt is deep sometimes both ways.
Am I just totally lost here!!??? I have a similar scenario. In my case the mismatch was that she was overly emotional while I would bottle things up. The key is to identify this discrepancy clearly and make both parties aware of it as a dynamic. Then you both work to meet in the middle. Being compatible with someone means that you actually get along well on a day to day basis and have similar goals which allow you to align your lives and future plans in an harmonious way.
It can be extremely confusing and endlessly hurtful for both parties to be in a relationship that is loving but essentially incompatible. Always being together is also a problem: Women are often insecure compared with men within a relationship.
Your response is very rational and analytical. I tire at these simplistic views of women as givers, emotional nurturers, etc. This article seems to be based on that simplistic premise. They can shell out the hurt and the selfishness every bit as much as men. To the women who came forward and owned your part of your own selfishness in this conversation I thank you, and I admire you. Or am I wrong? Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus.
Can we also get an article why men leave women they love? I believe this works both ways. Women who do this are not meant to be married, yet they like the concept of being married to avoid being lonely. Emotionally stunted women have been habituated to Disney like stories and relationships. Men work to provide for the women, but women leave men for not being a provider; they also leave men for working too much too.
Hammerman you hit the nail right on the head. And yes avoid them like the plague they will only damage you. I find that narcissistic people.. For my part, and I sense this is true of most men…, when she left me, then I realized that I had not LED in a way that she could get behind. Yes…, we men are scared. You women area scary to lead. One day it appears you want one thing, the next day another.
I swat myself figuratively on the back of the head because I missed it! Sure, I had and have, zest for life. She's closed her bubble even further. It is heartbreaking to see because she is such a FINE person inside. Few will ever know her like I do and did…, yet she can't see that for the broken-heartedness. I love and miss her so….
Don't be afraid to show her your weakness. THEN realize it is not a 'flaw' per se! No…, it is the condition of mankind. THAT is sexy as hell to a man!
She's there…, and she'll bend heaven-and-hell for you, if you securely bring HER to the fore. You are 'up' for the 'hunt'.
It is IN you to do so. Compete with yourself instead of at the golf game! Selfishness, in its' many iterations, has no place in a love relationship. Nice try on the 'these-are-my-likes, my-hobbies-and-you-should-respect-them'. That couldn't be more self-focused. I'm sorry my response was so long…. What I need is a partner, someone to walk beside me and treat me as an equal, someone who respects me, not someone who expects me to get behind them.
There are so many assumptions in your speech, about others that you just assume share your religious beliefs for one, but also a multitude of assumptions about your wife. How could you be married to someone for nearly 30 years and know so little about her? I think you spent years ignoring what she was trying to tell you, and if you were truly being honest with yourself, you would admit you know exactly why she left.
I wish every man felt this way — thanks for the hope. So sorry , it saddens me that people give up after 30 years. I still believe true love always come back you, even if I cant see it right now. We are definitely a product of our upbringing, and so many people have so many of their own fears and demons to overcome, most people are too afraid of themselves to go there with another person, but eventually it all comes out. Easy to say these things, very different to do them.
A relationship is a two-way street. No one is going to be your mommy and devote their whole heart to you again. Learn to be a little independent and manage your own emotional needs before committing to another person, step 1. My family is near eastern and we have many arranged marriages within my family, including my happily married parents of over 30 years. Has it been easy for them? A little weakness, neediness and co-dependence all well-disguised at sale of course is what keeps people together.
Truly strongly independent people are a little intimidating to the rest of the world. The trouble is not sex gender but human. We tend to take for granted. All too often, we may live with people we initially loved but after a while we treat them as part of the furniture. Another fair comment is that we again, all humans are highly prone to believe in the Fairy Tale, whether it is the Ken-and-Barbie fantasy of the young girl or the whatever of the man.
Easier said than done, but try to see your partner as he really is, not as you want him to be. Are you hoping to change someone? Very few are born with silver spoon now where they have money given from family to not have to work to jobs just for basics of living. I bet the men who quit there jobs to be with their woman more often have just as many break ups because then the woman says he does nothing even if it is with her all the time. No winning in relationships unless both people know their roles………..
Whether lonley, bored, no hobbies. So long as your unhappy your man will be as well. So many people look to this article to excuse the inexcusable. They lack discipline, morality and common decency. Life is not about having everything all the time and expecting others to do all the work. Working at something for reward further down the line and taking good times with the bad. Todays society does actibely discourages this. Before you cheat show your spouse the respect they deserve by facing them and airing the issues.
For either a man or a woman to leave a person they love is a character flaw, a failure, and a mistake. But there is never an excuse for a woman or a man to leave someone they love, without any danger or threat or harm, just out of feeling wanderlust or grumpy or the glass is half full or the grass might be greener somewhere else. The attitude of treating people like styrofoam cups — crumple it up and throw it away whenever it suits your convenience — is a deep, deep, deep profound moral cess pool, a severe character flaw.
After 15 years, I confronted my husband with the problems and with what I needed. The same conversation that we had over and over again. But this time, I gave him an ultimatum. I began to fall out of love that day. I began to go in to myself and, I believe, emotionally left the marriage, piece by piece, step by step, starting that day.
Eventually, several years later, I was swept off my feet by another man and physically left the marriage. The day that I decided to leave physically, my husband promised change. He promised all of those things that I had been asking for years from him. The tragedy was that it was too late.
The love was gone. Never in my life did I think that I had the capacity to be unfaithful. Several people have said that same thing that you say: This is trying to live. What alot of you people never seem to do before you get married is talk about your view on marraige. Cheating on a spouse leaving a spouse is never validated.
Your not in love with him or nor do you love him because of you did you would have never left him for another man regardless his flaws. People need to understand that no one is perfect and every piece of satisfaction we want from our spouses may not come.
Not mistakes, not arguments but death. We expect to much out of people rather than recognizing what they already do. We all as people need to be ready to accept imperfect people before we marry them and that was your mistake not his. Instead you were deceitful and cowardice.
You accepted his terms, you took him and accepted him. You went behind his back and betrayed him. Your comment discounts abusive relationships. There are intractable people out there. Sometimes leaving a person you love is exactly the right thing to do. So let me get this straight: Does that seem right? So is this author really saying on behalf of women: She wants to talk to you about what matters to her and to feel you hearing her….
I mean both should to the same and earn their way up in each others hearts and so forth. No one owns no ones soul, but men are owned just like that all the time and no one says a blip about us. The men go fishing alone and get old with their hobby and modern young women go clubbing while the 3 babies from the 3 different daddies are home baby sitted by others.
My husband is angry and critical all the time. Sometimes I wonder if I even want to save my marriage , being alone sounds more appealing at this point. This just made me sad and heartbroken. My husband will never understand this. There is going to come a time when my life will be just about me,when the kids are grown I will finally be able to put myself first.
Have you actually told your husband that? Exactly and clearly just like the above? Posted him this article and your response? Then gone and slept in the spare room for a few nights to prove the point? If yes, keep doing it repeatedly and remind your husband every time. Be clear and proactive about how both of you can change to make it better.
What you want is a great relationship, right? So why does he not want the same thing in the same form of intimacy? He does not want a great happy marriage? Of course he does. But neither of you know how. And it is really is both of you, sorry. Men do not do subtle. And in control of yourself. Otherwise you are being disingenuous about marriage. Maybe there is fear of vulnerability or misunderstanding of expectation, whatever it is.
This article is on point. This article is not even near the mark, in my opinion. It blames men, lol. Like women are not calculating and selfish. Why would any sane, sober, and successful man sign a contract to something that changes with the wind?
We are waking up to the fact that there is nothing in it for us men to marry. Society is selling men to the financial slaughter house.
I am not going. Even though I am one man, I will reach 10, with this truth. So, there it is ladies. Your dumb beta pool will dry up. Age treats a man better then it does women. All we need is money….. I also agree — spot on. You must surely have so many ladies weeping at your doorstep Justice. What a shame and so so sad … I get it totally. Give me a break! Marriage is supposed to be about togetherness. My wife is cheating on me because she is selfish.
Find a new guy, tell him what he wants to hear, tear out his heart and move on to the next. Fact is we all have a better chance on winning anything than finding a person who is loyal. As for the person who wrote this article, buddy run back to your wife and politely ask her for you balls back. The article is right. Women do leave for exactly that reason, and good riddance to them. Divorce was the best thing that ever happened to me. If your wife wants to live in some fantasy world where some guy is going to be madly infatuated with her every minute of her life regardless of how she behaves, smile and wish her the very best luck in her pursuit.
Single life is much better for guys anyway. I love what ur doing and I was a co-facilitor for a Father Invovment program. It was basically couples counselling and I loved the difference it made in the couples by simply teaching them to listen to each other and to just be there for each other. I would love to learn more about couples counseling for I feel there is a great need for it.
Check out David Schnarch. He sais this is a normal thing to happen in longterm monogamic relationships and explains how to surpass that stage rather than giving up. Tyler, your question seems sincere. I suggest you read and contemplate the responses from the women in here, and ignore the bitter or resentful responses from men. She has been trying to tell me these things for a long time. And she has been very close to leaving me, despite loving me.
It could have had a less pretentious title, but it actually is what it claims to be. It describes these concepts in great depth that the author here skims over briefly. More over, despite being worthwhile good provider, good father, loyal, etc , the fact is that these are just the things we are supposed to be doing anyway. But it never truly changes. He never truly changes. I sincerely hope that you plan to leave.
What good does 2 people that are not really living and are very sad do for each of you???? I wish you the best honey. I resonate Eliza — totally. Its the people pleasers. Now that is sad but its true — sorry guys, with respect. Its very painful talking to the trees and they hear nothing.
I gave up years ago and just do my own thing with my girlfriends — take care Eliza, just know you are not alone darling. Your husband loves you and he loves his kids and you depend upon him as a provider. He accepts that role out of love. Because being a provider is his expected role, it is his top priority and the one thing he will not willingly deface. There are three choices. None of these are comfortable options. Each option requires love: All options are both easy and hard: Hard because letting go completely when there are dependents is either impossible or long-term traumatic.
Easiest for the children, the most suffering to the soul of the parents. It is not the same as the fact. If you broke your arm.. If your inside is broke.. I was a dutiful breadwinner in a job that I loathed, and in the end my wife left me because of it. Doing your best to secure her a middle class life is not enough for most women. It may not be enough for your wife; ask her. Marriage can be the greatest thing in the world, and can be the worst thing in the world.
Maybe a middle class lifestyle is unimportant to her, and you trying your best to secure it is preventing you from doing your best to actually provide what she wants. No flawed wiring, just a disconnect between the two of you. So then it is okay to have preconceived thoughts and convince yourself that you are right all the time, not being able to listen or shut up long enough to understand or listen to your spouse, do as i say not as i do, and the ever popular….
Jus a few things as to why i DID divorce my wife. Have read a few in here, stopped at this one. So yeah this is my opinion and i own it, nothing to hide here. It sounds like your wife may have been in that category, so a moderator may have been very helpful. But, there is nothing wrong with admitting when it is over.
Just something to keep in mind for the future. The benefit of counselling is not only for the marriage per se. Some items need to be articulated by a third party!
There is intrinsic deep need, yes. But there is 'cause and effect' also. Your smug if it was smug: That said…, I'm sorry for your lost relationship and hope that you indeed are not a controlling, self-focused man who doesn't need anything so he doesn't 'have-anything-to-hide'. Truth is…, we all have very deep needs for deep connection with the ONE. Personally, I can give myself a middle class lifestyle without my husband.
But I still have no interest in living in the suburbs, having a white picket fence, or any of that crap. If I need money, I can make it myself — I have a good career and good work ethic. What I want is a partner for all that hiking, snow shoeing, and fun, as well as to weather the ups and downs with. Daniel, I totally relate to your experience!
I always had a job but it held no passion, it just paid the bills. But women like men are attracted to the excitement of passion from a new and unknown source.
They compare and unless you have the ability to sustain passion indefinitely, you stand to lose. In my marriage, my wife became distant when she used addictive pain medication. Not something outside of ourselves. It is the passion that is within us, that resonates from us.
Or, at least at some time is did. I think this is equally true of women and their husbands. Take the time to truly see him, be in the moment with him. I am a workaholic of sorts and am often too busy paid job, volunteer jobs, education to be present and in the moment, and choose and yes it is a choice! Thanks for the reminder. I woanted to write it, but it is even more strong when a women writes this! Do not worry about your passion for your wife, keep loving her, giving to her, and serving her.
This is the responsibility you took upon yourself when you married her. Giving is not about you but about her, what she needs and want she wants.
Just like if you had a little child, you could be in a bad mood… so what, you still have to feed the child or the child will simply die. In this situation, if you do not nourish the relationship, the relationship may die.
Once you fulfill your obligation as a man, you can work on finding your passion for life. Of cause first you have to figure out how you lost it, what the passion that sustained you in the past was based on…. Perhaps it is time to reevaluate your vision on where you are going… but all that self-searching must not interrupt your commitment to be a giver to your woman.
Even if it does not feel great to you at the moment…. Great words Peter Reznick, I think you hit it on the head. We are so self-absorbed it becomes hard to see other people, particularly those we live with.
Hopefully his wife is not too superficial to know that as well. This is a beautiful and siple article. We are faced with so many distractions from our one ture relationship with our one true love. Life is the distraction, all of it. And life is also the relationship we have with that one true love. The core of that relationship is Purpose and Dynamic. Purpose is not that complex really, it is what we are in the relationship for at one level yes, but it is more about what is the relationship there to create.
Dynamic is the how, the elements of action and interaction that executed effectively deliver the purpose. Whether, a relationship of marriage, parent, sibling, co worker, with any human being, they exist for a specific purpose and they have a specific dynamic.
Yes be present to the other person, this is vital, AND remain present to the purpose. By doing both, you will create opportunities for each to contribute to each other, to the relationship, and that alone can empower and build self worth and passion for life. Woman are much more about emotions and feelings than anything else. You put it very well…its what I have been trying to explain to my partner.
I stop talking and I tell him…your not even listening to me. Your doing me a courteousy. I dont want sex with you…booty calls is what I left for you. Many stressors and barriers come up…but its the consistent communication…touching me…its more than holding hands…its sharing energy.
We shared love to make a child…why cant we continue sharing. But women…we lack patience…. And the last time you felt an inkling at all?
Is there anything in common between those experiences? Good luck, you deserve a full and happy life, go out and make one! I suspect though I am not a councilor in any way that often the focus on work and other things to the detritement of their marriage is often as much a symptom as it is a cause, and it is not the sole responsibility of one to make the other not leave, it is the responsibility of both. People who leave people because they are providing a living for a family do so out of insecurities and greed.
It has nothing to do with love. I was in a sixteen year relationship with a man who had ambition, something to prove and provided a middle class life for me and the children. He was never present. Even when finally home, he was at the job in his head. You could rarely converse with him and he was always irritated with us for normal things that disrupted his work.
Our lives were quietly shelved when he was home. He could never connect with us, and sadly, though I may have lost years waiting for the glimmers when he did, he has missed out on life, and the beauty of connecting with people. This has an effect on the wife, longing always, trying to be noticed, losing self esteem and ending up lost herself. I left for self preservation. Depression and anxiety had me nearly crippled when we moved and all I had left was my never present man. I chose poverty and to struggle to live again.
I chose my children, my family and real love. No one should wait endlessly to live or love. I wish he could find such a happiness. When I first met Mr. C he had difficulty walking along with a well developed rash that covered much of his belly. When we fostered him he was to have limited walks in our yard and no contact with other dogs good thoughts did not enter his head as other dogs approached.
He settled right in and adopted us as part of his family. Wherever we went, he was quick to follow. He spent his outdoor time sniffing the bushes, the grass, the weeds, the concrete; the dude had a fantastic sniffer.
Sniffing the same bushes day after day never got old for him. Sticking close to us was just, well, normal for him. After the adoption was finalized I could take action on a hunch of mine.
Caesar was missing out on the thrill of living. He was an expert at making whatever situation he was in a good thing. Be it lazing around in the living room a snooze was always a welcome pastime , or smelling the same flowers day after day. Whatever it was, he found a way to enjoy it. He also knew how to ignore his limitations, namely his bad hips. How to expose him to new wonders? That was the question. Good for me and good for Caesar. A random question here: Nose, eye coordination has to be phenomenal.
I have no answer, just wonderment. But, my experience in working with exceptional sniffers is limited to just Caesar. So, let me share my Caesar observations: Sniffing was not limited to simply sniffing the air.
Oh, no, there was much more. Nose to target contact was desirable, no matter what. Yep, poop, dead things, rotten things, whatever, they all needed to be touched.
Yep, I quickly learned leash control, and to keep a sharp eye on the ground. Oh, yes, there is more. Drippy nose syndrome and a bit of drool. There were always wet patches on the ground after a Caesar smelling encounter.
Nope, not done yet. There is more; the tongue. Well, it was not uncommon for Caesar to lay-his-tongue on the object of interest. He would just stick his tongue out and plant it on whatever he was interested in. The laying-of-his-tongue was not a short duration laying; he would let his tongue lay for many seconds. Come back and are greeted by your buddy which includes lots of sniffing. Caesar did that and, when necessary, added a twist. I do a fair amount of construction related work.
Rarely wear gloves and occasionally come home with dinged up hands. Caesar is quick to greet and sniff. When his nose finds a scratch he very gently lays his tongue on the wound for a few seconds and then gently lifts his tongue. The process is repeated until he is satisfied with his doctoring or I tell him enough is enough. I must say, his tongue is very gentle. He takes his doctoring seriously and takes good care of his people. This took place while visiting family out of town.
I asked my pop if there would be any problems with walking Caesar in the neighborhood. Nothing he could think of came to mind.
Soon we were being stalked by a sweater wearing Chihuahua. He was pretty aggressive and not scared of Caesar. He had a hankering to take Caesar down. After walking some distance the little guy disappeared and we could enjoy our walk.
Just a few houses shy of our return the encounter took place. We were walking on the sidewalk, approaching a hedge separating two properties. As we passed the hedge I and Caesar spot the sweatered Chihuahua. A few feet from Caesar he launches himself. He is a missile and on target. Caesar took one step back and caught that guy in mid air.
It took some work but Caesar did let the little guy go. One of the events is shooting the canon; a very loud event.
Well, Caesar and I happened to be in the right place at the right time, right on the firing line. We were warned that the cannon blast can be scary for dogs and it would be prudent to move back several yards.
As the cannon fired Caesar jumped forward and attempted to charge. Not in the least. When Caesar naps he likes to prop his head against a chair, wall, or pretty much anything that will support his head.
From that point forward, we always kept pillows on his beds. We have property in the Sierra Foothills. We named it Caesarville. It is the one place where he can be free to do whatever he wants without boundaries, neighbors, or other dogs. There is a small dirt road leading from the house to the workshop. I walk on the road. Caesar walks near me but off the road and in the grass. Grass that is about as tall as him. You can see that he is in his own dream world and acting like a wolf taking slow and deliberate stalking steps.
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